Paypal is ridiculous

[Krier023]

Ok so I recently sold a jtag . it was an falcon elite with a 500gb for 280. the transaction went through and everything, so i shipped out using paypal for tracking, and signature confirmation. Taylor Gang disputed. I showed paypal I used their shipping and tracking for shippment, and taylor still won the dispute even though i used paypal to print tracking label, and it showed he signed for the package. He says that "his paypal was limited and thats why paypal disputed." and now he is saying it is my fault he disputed, and will not work with me at all. So now he has the item, and the money in his paypal which I believe is not limited.

(this is from 7s btw you dont actually need to know "taylor gang")

 

[odingalt]

Sorry to hear you've gotten ripped off. This is the same exact problem we had back when we used to accept PayPal from U.S. customers - a constant stream of disputed transactions from crooked buyers. PayPal doesn't care about you or do anything to protect you as a seller from getting ripped off. It's even worse when coupled with E-Bay. If my options are to sell something on E-bay or pay to throw it into the city dump, I pay to throw it into the city dump - because if I try to sell it on E-Bay by the time I pay shipping and transaction fees and get ripped off by the buyer, I would've saved money just throwing it away.

 

[Krier023]

Yeah I didnt really realize how bad it was. I saw you talk about it in other posts, but its different when you hear it, and when it actually happens. It just dumbfounds me that I used paypal to "print my shipping label" and bought signature confirmation directly from their website, and he still won the dispute.

3 big bills out of my pocket (that I could buy two more vikings with )

 

[odingalt]

No doubt this guy does nothing but make purchases on-line and dispute them constantly. I can attest that there are people who literally roam the internet looking for sellers who will accept payment via PayPal and ship USPS.

If you ship UPS or FedEx and require the adult adressee's signature only, you might stand a chance on a dispute. But the USPS signature confirmation isn't recognized by PayPal.

Let this be a warning to everybody else, unfortunately you can trust no-one on the internet and PayPal simply isn't a safe way to accept payment over the internet. Unfortunately I don't have any alternatives that I can suggest. Even money order/cashier's check are NOT the same as money! The buyer can purchase a money order or cashier's check and save the stub. Then they mail you the check. As soon as you ship the goods, they go back to the institution that issued the money order/cashier's check and place a stop-payment. They get their money back and you get overdraft fees once the check bounces in your account...

Just remember, MONEY ORDER is NOT the SAME AS CASH. NOTHING is the same as cash. Period. (I learned this one from some South Americans running this scam...)

Other countries to stay away from: Italy and Brazil. Fraud rates are extremely high to these countries and I advise not shipping to these countries, period.

 

[obo]

Couldn't you file a criminal case against the buyer in these sort of circumstances? I mean it might take awhile, but would there be any chance of it working?

 

[odingalt]

Civil court is definitely an option. The problem is I'm assuming you have to get on a plane and fly to another city/state to face the guy in his jurisdiction. Probably what happens is the deadbeat doesn't even show up to the court date and you are awarded the win by default. Now the problem is you our out $280 for the PayPal dispute, and you're out plane tickets and time off work, plus you're out court fees and lawyer fees, until the guy pays up.

Chances are he's a deadbeat with no job. f you really want your money then you have to hire a lawyer again to have the court garnish his wages. It'll cost you $5,000 to $10,000 by the time you've gotten this far, and again if the guy has no job and is a deadbeat... etc.... basically this is how deadbeat scam artists operate. They work on ripping off people in small enough amounts over and over and over again that it's not worth the time for each individual to try to get their money back. (It costs more to try to get back your $280 than to just give up).

They do this to tens or hundreds of people over the internet and make a living this way. Sure enough, that guy will be selling what you sold him on E-bay or craigslist to pocket the money and pay his rent. Unfortunately the only realistic solution is to avoid getting ripped off in the first place :-(.

 

[Voodoo]

Odin, 100% truth. I learned this the hard way. I will never deal with Paypal agIn, ever. If Paypal had a pen in Jack & the Bean Stalk, Jack would have gotten the beans, grew the stalk, snatched the Giant's lady, bag of gold, the hen, dozen golden eggs, married the chick, and had his Cow returned to him just because the beans preformed abnormally as far as green beans go.

Civil court is definitely an option. The problem is I'm assuming you have to get on a plane and fly to another city/state to face the guy in his jurisdiction. Probably what happens is the deadbeat doesn't even show up to the court date and you are awarded the win by default. Now the problem is you our out $280 for the PayPal dispute, and you're out plane tickets and time off work, plus you're out court fees and lawyer fees, until the guy pays up.

Chances are he's a deadbeat with no job. f you really want your money then you have to hire a lawyer again to have the court garnish his wages. It'll cost you $5,000 to $10,000 by the time you've gotten this far, and again if the guy has no job and is a deadbeat... etc.... basically this is how deadbeat scam artists operate. They work on ripping off people in small enough amounts over and over and over again that it's not worth the time for each individual to try to get their money back. (It costs more to try to get back your $280 than to just give up).

They do this to tens or hundreds of people over the internet and make a living this way. Sure enough, that guy will be selling what you sold him on E-bay or craigslist to pocket the money and pay his rent. Unfortunately the only realistic solution is to avoid getting ripped off in the first place :-(.

 

[obo]

Couldn't you have the suit filed in your own home town? Or there has to be some way to settle things legally other than flying all the way out to where the idiot lives.

 

[Voodoo]

Nope, legal proceedings must take place where the accused resides. They get home court advantage, since you are the one issuing the legal challenge, so to speak.